I Ching books?

[Os3y3ris]

Any reccomendations on I Ching material? I'm curious as to the mathematics of the I Ching, the way that the symbols are organized and expressed and what they represent in various contexts.

Got interested in it after taking a look at the Korean flag, not knowing what it meant and realizing I'd read a bit about that symbolism. So I look in my old TKD book and they're talking about the taegeuk. I look that up and realize that the taegeuk is the basis for the taegeuk forms which is something I really should've known. Ultimately I wish to be able to express my interpertation of TKD through sound I Ching symbolism as practically speaking, I only use certain parts of the taeguk.

[SAMURAI36]

PEACE O:

It's good that you are deciding to do the knowledge on this book.......This is the spiritual/philosophical basis of martial arts, and its also the book that is often called the "WU-TANG MANUAL".

I am a fan of this version:



I like study/reference guides when it comes to books of this nature, and this version offers that.....

It gives translations of meaning of words used in the I-CHING, as well as history about events during the time when the I-CHING was in heavy use in the ORIENT.

PEACE

[Os3y3ris]

Didn't know that that was what the Wu Tang manual was. Interesting,

[SAMURAI36]

To add-on, the I-CHING is also one of the basises for CHESS, with the 64 hexes.

[Dr. D-Resperatation]

PEACE all

I have "The I Ching Workbook" by Roger Green, "A Step-by-step Gueide to LEarning the Wisdom of the Oracles". Contents are:

Introduction:
THe clasic book of Eastern philosophy
Origins
A universal Message
About the Book

Chap. 1.
KEY CONCEPTS OF THE I CHING
Universal Energy
Yin and Yang
Buiding blocks of the I Ching
Origins of the trigrams
The hexagrams

Chapter 2
CONSULTING THE I CHING
Honering the I Ching
Clearing Your Mind
Preparing Your Space
Pereparing yourself
Knowing what to ask
An I Ching ritual

Chap. 3
THE EIGHT TRIGAMS
Key to the trigrams
Heaven
Earth
THundre
WInd
Water
Fire
MOuntain
Lake
Trigrams and Social Interactions

Chap. 4
HOW TO CONSTRUCT A HEXAGRAM
Methods of casting
The coins
COin Casting metheod
Bead casting method
Identifuing your hexagram
Interpretijg the hexagrams

Chap55.
ADVANCED HEXAGRAM READINGS
Chenging lines
the position and meaning of the changing line
The progressed hexagram
Nuclear hexagrms

CHap. 6.
THE SIXTY FOUR HEXAGRAMS OF THE I CHING
Stratagy for reading the hexagrams
Interpreting the answer
Gueide to the hexagrams
Hexagrams1-64
Your reflectons on the I ching

Chapter 7
OUR INTERACTION WITH THE SPIRITUAL
How to use the lucky ming gua number

Further reading
Answeres to workbook exercizes
Glossary INdex
Quick refercnec guide

It does not seem that this book is a in depth/ thourough as the one Sam7 posted, as it only has short sectons on the suposed origns of the book.

I have a copy of the movie, "Born Invincible" which is relevent to the I Ching, i surmize, on various leavels that go beyond my head, in one part a Martial Artist while fighting eches out the eight trigrams into a circle in the sand with his feet.

One question:

SAMMURAI7ASSASSIN, when the I Ching is refered to as the Wu Tang Manuel, what does Wu Tang mean?

Accoring to a Book by Jose Argules called, "The Mayan Factor", i believe, varoiuos Jesuite English Scholars who first arived at China went mad studying the I Ching.
Is this perhaps what RZA refers to in TRAGEDY when he says, "...hijak the wu tang manuel under his blanket/ cant interpret cause your brain to short curcuit..."

Just a thought.

PEACE

[Os3y3ris]

I have a copy of the movie, "Born Invincible" which is relevent to the I Ching, i surmize, on various leavels that go beyond my head, in one part a Martial Artist while fighting eches out the eight trigrams into a circle in the sand with his feet.

Its a common martial arts symbol. Depending on the art it means various things. Each of the trigrams represents an element. These can be represented through elemental forms, as seen in the taegeuk, balance, proper manipulation of force and other things.

[SAMURAI36]

Os3y3ris said:

Its a common martial arts symbol. Depending on the art it means various things. Each of the trigrams represents an element. These can be represented through elemental forms, as seen in the taegeuk, balance, proper manipulation of force and other things.

O, please understand, that martial arts are based on the I-CHING, not the other way around.

I would implore you to approach the I-CHING with this understanding, and you'll gain more out of it.

[Os3y3ris]

I disagree. The I-Ching is, among other things, a system of symbols. Which symbols are displayed, how they are displayed and the way that they are organized reflects a different meaning. The root of it will not change, but the display and meaning will change based on the art.

[SAMURAI36]

This is wholly incorrect.

That's like saying that "GOD" is limited to the various spiritual systems that mentions Him, and the symbols used therein.

It's the symbols that are "new", not the concepts that they represent, which are Eternal.

And as I said, martial arts is a derivative of this, not vice versa.

You do know what "I-CHING" means, yes?

[Os3y3ris]

I was referring to the symbols themselves in terms of their display in the martial arts. The concepts are the basis for a lot of martial arts systems, but the symbols in question, which is what was being discussed in the posts above are determined often by the characteristics of the system. Thats all i mean. Seems we really aren't in disagreement.

[Subtle Energies]

The actual I ching is the basis for Xing Yi ( mind-form) boxing. The Pakua (8 diagram) is the basis for 8 diagram (pakua) boxing. Tai chi is the third art and is based on the principles of ying and yang. The 5 elements, the 8 trigrams and the ying and yang are all drawn upon from Taoist philosophy and used in these martial arts ( Actually I think it would definately be the other way around).

I spent alot of time trying to work out this I Ching book. I was actually doing a maths degree and had to give a speech. I tried to break down the hexagram arrangement and the maths behind it. The sad truth is I kept coming up with little strong mathematical evidence I could speak on.

Basically, to break it down back to basics the I Ching is an oracle made up of 64 hexagrams. Each hexagram is the combination of two triagrams (heaven, thunder, water, mountain, earth, wind, fire, lake) each of which is a three line combination where yang is represented by a solid line and Yin by a broken line. Each hexagram has a meaning and some advice for the consulting person.

There was a whole bunch of things on the King Wen arrangement of the hexagrams and some time wave. this however is where I ran in to a lack of real evidence and several other web pages agreeing with this.

However, one thing that amazed me was the I Ching landscape. It can be seen here

www.fourpillars.net/pdf/kingwen.pdf

This site explains the way in which the hexagrams paint out an actual landscape. I have also read of this as a metaphor for the life span of a person.

Also there was a binary system present in the I Ching.

I am really annoyed right now coz I had all these digrams showing the patterns of the lay out and the binary and the sequences in motion and I don't anymore I will have to get back to this thread if i can ever hunt them down again.

[Subtle Energies]

I also just wanted to add, I heard the guy who spent his life sorted out the binary system was given a copy after by a Jesuit monk and he went mad.

[Subtle Energies]

;D I am back!

Ok this is my favourite siteo n the hexegram arrangments.

www.biroco.com/yijing/sequence.htm

it shows the sequences, the binary. The diagram showing the 64 in black and white derived from yin and yang I love.

This is definately your best source to start if you want to get into some of the maths behind these tricky little triagrams.

[Subtle Energies]

I actually have a question I have never been able to work out . I will be impressed by a reliable explanation of this.

One thing I have never been able to work out is how each triagram's particular combination of yin and yang lines relates to the triagram it represents. In some of them I have a few vague ideas....

Like fire is Yang and yang inclosing a yin line. To me this could represent the outward appearance of the flame being dangerous but that its essential empty....
Water is the negative of fire...it appears soft but actually is forceful at the core.

A couple of the others I have similar little ideas on but some I draw a blank...

I would be grateful if anyone has a reliable explanation of this matter.

[Subtle Energies]

I just noticed Sam's comment...
I trained in the only internal art directly "based" on the I Ching under a very very tradition taoist master.

I strongly disagree with your comment. I believe after studying the arts that it is just as likely, if not more that the I Ching was derived from internal and alchemical practices, and not vice versa.

These people are very intuitive. My master learnt in China from masters who were hermits. The knowledge is actually lived...a book would be his last resort for transferrence and collecting of knowledge....

And just so my story about hermits doesn't seem like BS you can all google my master Sun Da Fa. He is a national treasure of china.

In studying with him in the art of Xing yi for a relatively short period of time I changed my out look on the world. A lot of things changed about me...you would be surprised the types of sensations and intuitions come about from performing a movement which is the energy of metal 1500 times a day...