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Post by CIVILISON on Jul 9, 2005 11:08:27 GMT -5
PEACE You mad philosopher, I don't know how you come up with these ill concepts but they are working out just fine! A few questions though: OK, in literal terms the word "ego" translates into an exaggerated state of self-importance, however you have demonstrated to deem this word of a different semantic background. How do you perceive the ego and do you see a relation between its literal and conceptual definition? Is is said that there exists the SELF and the PERSON. The self being the fundamental undifferentiated state of being susceptible solely to divine attributes and the person being our association with our emotional and habitual patterns (who and what we THINK we are). How would you fit “ego” into what I just said? I agree... Choice is a result of free will, unless you consider choice an electro-chemical impulse imposed on the brain. Man's choices are based on PERCEPTION or AWARENESS (although I prefer to use the term perception) and those are based upon a few things: - A human's perception depends upon his IDENTITY and an idea of what or who man this he or she is. This also implies his capabilities and limitations.
- I love the expression "what the brain thinks and the eyes see, the mind believes" and I think this can be applied to this build. Perception (at least in this crazy world) is based upon what man is taught. Meaning, his personal BELIEFS.
- We must not forget that the imaginative faculty and the intellectual faculty affect men's choices therefore those are of a vital importance
But do those things that man perceive to be real are really real? Or is it just an illusion? For instance, men believes that each one of us are separate existences and while on a level this is true there also exists a universal connectivity between us. However, the physical realm tricks us into believing that we all exist separately. There is no sense of UNION. Our society is all about segregation! I won't comment until you build upon your perception of the ego as I do not want to quibble over semantics again. But I think I know what you mean and yes, I think you’re on point! PEACE |
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Post by CIVILISON on Jul 9, 2005 11:13:51 GMT -5
Some current thoughts of mine:
-- A wise man makes money, a fool is made by money.
-- Can life be a review of past experiences so that those can lead us to yet another, bigger, expererience?
-- There is a difference between knowledge and information.
PEACE
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 9, 2005 18:16:14 GMT -5
almost a dozen times today i thought of something
and said to myself:
"i gotta post that on the board"
and then i got to my computer
and forgot all of them
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 9, 2005 18:31:22 GMT -5
OK, in literal terms the word "ego" translates into an exaggerated state of self-importance, however you have demonstrated to deem this word of a different semantic background. How do you perceive the ego and do you see a relation between its literal and conceptual definition? Is is said that there exists the SELF and the PERSON. The self being the fundamental undifferentiated state of being susceptible solely to divine attributes and the person being our association with our emotional and habitual patterns (who and what we THINK we are). How would you fit “ego” into what I just said? PEACE i guess the term 'ego' that i was using is the 'who we think we are' - or PERSON in terms of your explanation maybe it is possible to come to an agreement here: there is the PHYSICAL OBJECT part of you there is the SOMETHING (CHI / LIGHT / WHATEVER) which animates the physical object combine the two together and you have something which is in the cycle of MOVE - OBSERVE - MOVE - OBSERVE - MOVE hmm this is getting sticky hard to explain with words especially when searching for absolute truths PEACE maybe more to build on later... |
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 9, 2005 18:36:49 GMT -5
Some current thoughts of mine: -- A wise man makes money, a fool is made by money. -- Can life be a review of past experiences so that those can lead us to yet another, bigger, expererience? -- There is a difference between knowledge and information. PEACE PEACE PEACE PEACE yo that last one is a jewel straight up from what i can see INFORMATION covers everything - knowledge AND TRICK knowledge so while KNOWLEDGE is INFORMATION TRICK KNOWLEDGE (LIES) is also INFORMATION --- talk about wolves in sheep clothes--- (who let that guy in here?) as far as #2 goes: life could be a review of past experiences but whether it is or it isnt doesnt seem to be of much consequence (i dont think experiences can be 'bigger' or 'smaller') PEACE |
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 9, 2005 18:38:04 GMT -5
oh i remembered one:
possessions are like anchors for people aspiring to walk on water
PEACE
(have you ever seen a bird try to fly with an mp3 player attached to it?
it looks ridiculous)
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Post by CIVILISON on Jul 9, 2005 23:27:00 GMT -5
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Understanding understood!
Indeed, but no need for words here. Mind detect mind!
DAMN, you made me realize something here.
And while I wholeheartedly agree, I did not establish this idea before.
Basically, there is no small or big experience because within the framework of our total evolution, there are RELATIONS. Everything fits within the picture.
It's just like "there is no" BAD or GOOD but there are RELATIONS. One does not exists within the other yet within each of those there is the possibility of manifesting the other's quality (the white on the black part of yang, the black on the white part of yin). Everything is interconnected. A quality exists only because it is based on another things’ quality.
Interesting perspective but I was actually aiming at something else. Let me demonstrate it this way.
1. "A" -------> "B" ------> "C"
2. "A" ------> "C" .........,......... "B"
Point A symbolizes us, the experiencer, point C represents reality and point B is the medium through which we are informed of the reality.
In situation #1, the experiencer is informed of the reality through verbal and intellectual data or information and experiences its being through the medium of INFORMATION. In other words, he/she is INFORMED of the reality and lacks the direct experience of it.
In situation #2, the experiencer has direct contact and encounter with the given reality. Information of the reality exists independently of this experiencer’s encounter with the reality. The experiencer receives direct KNOWLEDGE of the reality. In other words, instead of being INFORMED he has direct experience and KNOWS through self-experienced concrete reality.
This is basically the KNOWING VS BELIEVING analogy.
KNOWLEDGE is to KNOW (for a fact) and information is to be INFORMED.
And what comes after KNOWLEDGE……… WISDOM. How can we wisdom if we don’t have the proper foundation established?
How do you cee this, LIGHT?
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That anchor statement is indeed insightful.
Sometimes I think it is not the POSSESION per se that we stress over, but the attachment we have with the possession. This possession could as well be an emotion, for instance overeating.
I think it is when we face the possibility of a shortage or loss of the possession that we stress out the most.
Like having a loved one and loosing him/her.
Have you seen the movie HEAT with De Niro and Pacino?
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Another thought of mine....
In life, we meet certain people for a reason but do we also take under consideration the fact that some people meet us for a reason as well? We have to work with that piece of the puzzle.
ONE LOVE
(...never looked at birds while listening to an mp3 player, but then again I don't currently own one... ;D...)
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 10, 2005 8:47:40 GMT -5
PEACE CIVIL
i wrote that bird joke wrong
its the bird wearing the mp3 player - get it? - birds dont have possessions and thus can fly...
(drum roll)
ha ha
PEACE
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 10, 2005 8:52:14 GMT -5
. Interesting perspective but I was actually aiming at something else. Let me demonstrate it this way. 1. "A" -------> "B" ------> "C" 2. "A" ------> "C" .........,......... "B" Point A symbolizes us, the experiencer, point C represents reality and point B is the medium through which we are informed of the reality. In situation #1, the experiencer is informed of the reality through verbal and intellectual data or information and experiences its being through the medium of INFORMATION. In other words, he/she is INFORMED of the reality and lacks the direct experience of it. In situation #2, the experiencer has direct contact and encounter with the given reality. Information of the reality exists independently of this experiencer’s encounter with the reality. The experiencer receives direct KNOWLEDGE of the reality. In other words, instead of being INFORMED he has direct experience and KNOWS through self-experienced concrete reality. This is basically the KNOWING VS BELIEVING analogy. KNOWLEDGE is to KNOW (for a fact) and information is to be INFORMED. And what comes after KNOWLEDGE……… WISDOM. How can we wisdom if we don’t have the proper foundation established? How do you cee this, LIGHT? . . . . . PEACE i would say that any MEDIUM is part of reality a direct part of reality to understand reality that you receive thru a medium one needs to understand the effect that a medium can have on the aspect of reality that they are delivering when a messenger delivers a message the messenger becomes a part of the message PEACE |
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Post by CIVILISON on Jul 10, 2005 23:34:59 GMT -5
PEACE BROTHER
I must admit, this stimulated my mind a bit, here is mine conclusion.
I do agree with what you say, when you smell an apple you do experience an aspect of its reality (however significant or insignificant it may be or seem).
Peace, I cee you in this one.
Now…
With INFORMAION, the effect on the reality can be huge.
At best the INFORMATION gives us an idea of what the reality is and at worst it misinterprets and misguides us into believing that the reality is or is not what it truly is. Kind of what you said with the trick-knowledge.
Now…
-The Tao That Can Be Told Is Not The True Tao-
I want to expound upon my view, consider it an addendum to my last assertions.
Please keep in mind that right now I am speaking of abstract concepts or absolute truths as you so eloquently have presented.
WISDOM is innately contained within nature and the universe. We extract this “wisdom” and put it into verbal form (INFORMATION). I have already introduced to you in the other build the concept of the “putting into verbal forms concepts that are otherwise recognized non-verbally.”
Realities that are recognized non-verbally do not need to be processed and interpreted by the verbal faculty as they can be essentially INsperieced directly. Yes, let’s say that they are a part of reality but when it comes down to this, do we really need this medium?
We can directly experience a given reality instead of being informed about it.
For instance, justice…
This is an abstract concept that has been degraded by our society into verbal forms, structures and definitions. We follow these verbal rules without ever experiencing the reality of justice.
It is only when we realize, actualize and insperience the interconnectedness between all things that we experience the reality of justice. The harm that I have done unto you I have just done onto myself.
NEVERTHELESS, without any doubt in my mind, I believe we NEED this medium as a "starter kit" for thought process (again, the relation between the reality and the medium). The scent will eventually lead you to the apple!
As a matter of fact, we are using it right now so it’s living proof.
Damn, it is truly an art to explain verbally ideas like these over the internet but I am trying to do my best.
Tell me if you follow me and add on with anything else you think is relevant!
I am trying hard to understand your approach to this notion as well.
Thank you deeply for your contributions!
PEACE
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Let's go straight to the source...
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Post by CIVILISON on Jul 10, 2005 23:35:39 GMT -5
Oh, and that bird joke... ;D  LOL! |
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 12, 2005 8:37:43 GMT -5
jesus was a trickster
robots can become human
we will throw trash into volcanoes
PEACE
i will expand on the above later
i just wanted to get them all down before i forgot
oh yeah
and i have something to say about metaphors
PEACE
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 13, 2005 18:48:24 GMT -5
a couple more:
death and time travel
the universe is autistic
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Post by CIVILISON on Jul 16, 2005 4:59:01 GMT -5
Arrogance is an impediment
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Post by Healthy Merking on Jul 17, 2005 8:49:48 GMT -5
PEACE
in taking a closer look at the 'end date' proposed by the mayan calendar
it seems that the big difference between now and then will be this:
over the past 25,000 years - we allowed ourselves to be led to believe that the planet earth and the universe were things which could be controlled by us
we are finding out that this is not true
the truly 'righteous' are those who are able to accept this fact (the true meaning of peace)
while those who will 'perish' in the transition are those who are unable to come to terms with this
PEACE
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